Why High-Achieving Women Underearn (And How to Break the Cycle) with Lisa Kalmin

INTRO: After generating over a million dollars in sales and selling one of her businesses with a single email, your host Catherine Thompson, takes an unconventional approach to marketing and sales. So if you are ready to tap into a more powerful way to be seen, heard, and a Sought after Entrepreneur in your industry without having to spend endless hours marketing your business and chasing clients, you are in the right place.

Be The Sought After Entrepreneur Podcast is here to help you ditch the cookie cutter one size fits all approach to marketing, and use your unique energy to effortlessly attract the most aligned clients. When you do this, you can spend less time marketing your business and more time doing your soul work and enjoying the richness of your life.

Welcome to Be The Sought After Entrepreneur Podcast, and here's your host, Kathryn Thompson.

K. Thompson: Hey, hey, I am super stoked to have Lisa Kalman on the show today to [00:01:00] talk all things abundance beyond just the money aspect of it. So without further ado, I'm just gonna turn it over to you, Lisa, so you can give a brief intro to our listeners who you are and what you do, and who you serve.

Oh, thank you. Thank you. Thank you, Katherine. I'm so happy to be here. I'm so thrilled. My name is Lisa Kelman. I am a transformational trainer coach. I call myself a mindset wizard and you know, transformation in the day when I actually started Profe personal development was like, nobody knew what that meant.

Now you hear it all the time. Yeah. So I have been participating with people in terms of how they see the world, how they see life, how they come to life, who they're actually the quality of their beingness, if I can, versus the mechanics of doing for the last 38 years. So over the last 38 years, I've, I've trained in many different countries, Asia, Americas.

South America, [00:02:00] and, uh, it's really my joy. I, I feel super blessed to have found what I was supposed to be doing. I love that. I love that. I think there's a lot of people out there that spend a lot of their life seeking that. Yeah. Like seeking their purpose. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I feel like, oh my gosh, what a gift.

I found this in my late twenties, you know, it's super happy. So amazing. So amazing. And so, um, I know our listeners are gonna want us to dive straight into sort of, I. The essence of abundance, creating wealth and prosperity in our world, um, as entrepreneurs. So if you could share just a little bit with our listeners, your unique perspective on abundance and creating wealth and prosperity in your life.

Yeah. Uh, well, you know, we were talking a little bit before we started abundance. For a lot of people, they immediately think about money. And that is a form of abundance. And I [00:03:00] really invite people to look at abundance from not just money, but also how we relate to time, uh, energy, love, uh, vitality, et cetera.

And so abundance, one of my favorite definition is an overflowing sufficient supply, an or a plentiful supply like flowing, just an over. My, when I work with people, I really ask them to consider that, you know, the world universe, God, however they have that is already abundant. It is that abundance is, and if it, if abundance exists, then we're either stopping abundance from flowing to us or we're attracting abundance.

Same thing with money, same thing with money. If we wanna talk wealth and money in that way. You know, money is really an exchange of energy. Ultimately, it's energy. You know, I, I [00:04:00] always make this example, like if you think about money five or 600 years ago, it was an exchange of things like furs or spices or pelts, something like that.

Yeah. We had these coins, people used coin, gold, silver, copper, nickel, et cetera. Yeah. We had cash, which I still like. We had cash and then we had checks, which, you know, actually I do write a couple of checks a a year. Then we have these little plastic things called credit cards and debit cards. And now most people do this.

I'm picking up my phone. If you're just listening. Yeah. They just hack their phone. My um, I live in the United States and my Whole Foods literally has a device where you put your home over the device and it charges you for your groceries. Wow. Money has, and now we have cryptocurrency. Obviously money has has shifted form, but it's an exchange of energy and everything is energy.

If you break us down to our smallest tiny particle, it's this energy moving. So if [00:05:00] money is energy, it can be attracted and it can. So again, we're either blocking it or we're attracting it. Yeah. And I love that correlation between even time, energy, love, right? That overflow, you use the word overflow. And so I want to kind of dive in 'cause I know that my listeners are high achievers, very ambitious.

Probably a lot of women. There's men in there as well, um, that are like results oriented ars. Do you see any correlation in the work that you've done around the blocks? Yes. With these high achievers and how they can be blocking money? Specifically when we're talking about the overflow and maybe the not overflowing.

Yes. Yes. Uh, a couple ways. So for the, especially high achieving women, women in general, there is a already existing cultural bias around women and money. And still to this day, women [00:06:00] make somewhere, I think it's 70 something percent, 76, 70 8%, um, for the same job a man would do. The average is that women are still making less.

So culturally there is this, uh, already existing sort of energy and, and, and, and limits. And then the other thing that occurs is if, if money is energy and we wanna attract the flow, you know most women, again, that are high achieving typically step a lot into their masculine energy. Yeah. And masculine energy is very important.

The balance is super important because you've gotta be directional, you gotta be focused, you gotta have some motivation. And what it. Often does is if a woman is really into that, sort of go get it. Go get 'em, go get 'em. She's not allowing for that feminine flow and attraction. So that can be in the way in [00:07:00] an unconscious level.

Interesting. So, and another thing I work with people about both men and women is Yeah. So many people have done a lot of great personal development, and I'm sure your people have, 'cause I've listened to your podcast and you really speak to a deep place and I love that. What we do is we generally. Do some, you know, mindset work or whatever you wanna call it, belief work.

But we don't go deep into particular areas. And so what I've done is I've taken some time and developed an opportunity for people to really look at, you know, what are some of the unconscious or, or limiting stops and beliefs that we brought into our adulthood from childhood about money. So some great questions for somebody to journal on.

Are, you know, what, what were the verbal and cultural messages that I received? Both. Both verbal and modeled? Yeah. Both verbal and modeled as I was growing up [00:08:00] around money. So that's family of origin, parents, aunties, uncles, grandparents, culture, you know, whoever you hung out with. Your neighborhood, your, your peeps.

Yeah. And what was modeled as much as what was spoken. Start diving into what were those messages? It can get really rich, and then how has that influenced my ability to make money, save money, you know, spend money, et cetera. It's really, yeah, I love the depth that you take people to, because as you said, I think as high achievers, at least as my experience, we're very intellectual and cerebral.

So for us to learn personal development, we can learn it. Yeah. Right. And, and I talk about the, the information age or the guru era, right. I talk about that and I, and what I'm really talking about there is, for us high achievers, we intellectualize so much, but we don't actually embody it. Like it actually doesn't get integrated into our existence.

And so then. [00:09:00] Decades can go by, right? A lot of the women I work with have been doing what they've been doing for 20 plus years, and they're like, I'm still in the same cycle as I was in my early thirties or my mid thirties, or my mid forties or my fifties. Why am I repeating this same cycle with money, with wealth, with abundance?

And one thing that I've seen is this time relationship, like you talk about being in the masculine, overproducing, overgiving, and they don't actually have a great relationship with time. Would you say then therefore not necessarily a great relationship with money? Or can you even make that correlation?

Well, if I'm coming from scarcity, yeah. Like, you know, not, there's not enough. You know, again, one of the sort of cultural energies that we are born into is scarcity. I. Another one is separation. Like I know physically we're separated, but again, if you break us down to our tiniest particle, we're all the same anyway.

Scarcity, we're born into it and if there's, and scarcity is, there's not enough, but, [00:10:00] but we internalize it as there's not enough for me. Per, it's pervasive along, not just money, time, energy, love. Think about love. Alright, so love is intangible. You know, you could be loving and generate love like that. You don't have to have money, you don't have to have status, you don't have to have anything, you know anything.

But we dole it out. You know, like, alright, well gave you some love now when am I getting my love back? And it's like, we have these little, little yeah. We doll out from our heart and instead of I love you very much. It, it, we might as well say, I trade you very much. Ooh. If I give you, if I open up, I give you my heart and, and then I don't get anything back, I'm gonna start to close down.

'cause I don't wanna be hurt. 'cause I don't wanna be rejected, whatever that is. Yeah. Uh, you know, you think of somebody like Mother Teresa or, or you know, Jesus or anyone is like the love exude. [00:11:00] There was never a lack of. Yeah. And so scarcity is sort of this cultural, there's not enough. So I have to get more, get more, get more.

You know, I, I make this joke and, and George Carlin, who's this older comedian, died year, died years ago. You know, you the United States, I'm not sure, I don't know if you're in, are you in Canada? I'm in Canada, yeah. I don't know if this is true in Canada. Um, in the United States, the only place I've ever been where we have storage units for all our stuff.

Yeah, we do too. Yeah. We have to keep our stuff. Yeah. And George was great, uh, bit on this. So in order to, to get out of scarcity. Couple things, especially time. Let's talk about time for a second. So one of the things that hasn't served us is our phone and the technology. 'cause we're constantly disconnecting.

Yeah. So being present in the moment, we've all had a moment. Have you ever had a moment where you're like, just in a [00:12:00] moment, and maybe it's a wedding or maybe it's a time with somebody you love or a family member or just it's. You're in this beautiful place in nature and this, this experience just overwhelms you with, with being fulfilled and, and time starts to, you know, it, it not, not matter either evaporate or, or expand or whatever that is.

Yeah. So being fully present will help that. Yep. Instead of always worried about what's the next thing I need to do, being in the moment I. Yeah, will so support that as well. And my experience is people who are really, really, really tight and scarce about time also tend to, this isn't obviously everybody, but tend to have, um, a little bit more trouble connecting and being, uh, connected in relationships or, or intimate in relationships.

I don't mean intimate sexually, I mean intimate in a [00:13:00] emotional way. Yeah. Yeah. I was like, yeah, so, so just slowing down breath is a great Yeah. And, and breathing and, and opening that space up. Yeah. Because we all know people with tons to do tons on their plate and they seem to be fully present and have time for us.

Yeah, and it's such an interesting perspective 'cause you talk about being in the moment and like time, just sort of like I. Disappearing because you're just so in it. And then there's the contrary, which I've experienced many times is you're out in these beautiful places and you're actually not there.

Yeah. Like mind is completely somewhere else because you're like running the to-do list. Or did I forget something? Like you're just not even present. And there's many moments in my career, in my experience where I've, I've been in these beautiful places like Hawaii or whatever, and I'm like. I wasn't even really there.

Or, or even like to take a picture like, oh, I [00:14:00] have to stop and take a picture. I'm taking myself out of this moment of experiencing. Yeah. And now I'm, I need to sort of capture it for some later time. Yeah. Document it. Yeah. And that's, so coming back with our relationship with time, you talk about love, you know, money being energy, and would you say that scarcity is the biggest root issue?

There's a couple of things. Yeah, there's a scare. There's the cultural influence, scarcity, you know, things like money doesn't go on trees. You gotta work really hard. I mean, this is was here long before we were born. It'll probably be here long after. Yeah. And then there's our individual way we relate to money, which a lot of, again, was modeled by our upbringing.

Whether it's mom and dad or it and again, or verbal. Or verbal, I'll never forget, I use this example. Um. I was in in the 1970s. I was [00:15:00] a teenager and it was quote, the energy crisis, which, you know, of course it wasn't, but at the time it felt like it. And I would leave a room and my dad was a super chill guy and he would follow me and he wouldn't say anything, but he would follow me around the house and he would turn the lights out after I left a room.

And so there was this message, oh. There's not something, you know, I've gotta be careful or I've gotta watch out. And then I've heard people tell me, a couple of different clients have told me that their parents didn't talk about money, but when the kids went to sleep, they would fight about money.

Interesting. So it became a source of, uh. Pain or discomfort to be about money. The other place people get stuck is what I call a, A wealth set point. Yeah. Probably heard this analogy before. You know there's thermometer and a thermostat. Yeah. A thermometer goes up and down based on the conditions. It's taught outside.

It goes up, it's cold, [00:16:00] goes down a thermostat, sets the conditions around it. We have a money thermostat. So, for example, for some people it's in the amount of money that comes in. Like no matter what they do, they end up with the same amount of revenue. Yeah, some people it's what's left over profit or what's ever left over.

How many of us have had a moment where different amount of money comes into our bank account at the beginning of the month? Always the same amount. Same amount, always. Yeah. Or we could have a debt set point like, uh, I don't know. I've done this where I get my debt down, you know, not mortgage, but credit card or whatever, and then all of a sudden something big happens and I spin and I'm back up.

Or savings set point, like I get my savings to a certain amount, then the water heater breaks or the, you know, something big. Yeah, gotta use it. So look at where you have a pattern or a set point. Yeah, that can be a limit as well, so, [00:17:00] okay. And so if somebody has a set point and they identify, said set point, right?

How do they shift through that? Like what is the actual why? Why is that set point there? Yeah. Well, the set point is there because we're playing out a pattern. I've heard you talk about identifying patterns. Yeah. And you know, patterns. For me, when I identify a pattern, there's always the source of the pattern is some kind of limiting belief.

Yeah. Some kind of, uh, belief about myself or the world. That is, that is a limitation. So if I ident, first of all, identify the pattern, most people don't take the time to go, oh. Wow. So this has happened in my life several times. I'm the common denominator. They think, oh, the water heater broker, oh, I lost the job.

Or, oh, the industry shut down, or, oh, my client. Decided not to work with me. Whatever it looks like it's the outside conditions. Well, we're the thermostat, setting up the conditions. So once you're willing to [00:18:00] be responsible, like take responsibility for, oh, okay, I'm the common denominator here. Hmm. What is, what's going on?

Even if you don't know the exact source of why you can begin to affirm something different. Yeah. And I used to, I promise you, I used to, when I first heard about affirmations, I thought it was a bunch of hooey, you know, blah, blah. Yeah. But I've learned enough scientific, scientific stuff and, and research that what we affirm and bring our energy to alignment will manifest.

Yeah. So I just invite people to just begin a very simple affirmation like. Because I don't, I have a hard time remembering long things. Yeah. So I just make simple for myself. I am so happy and grateful for, mm. I'm so grateful for the $50,000 in my savings account. I'm so happy and grateful for the, you know, less than a thousand dollars debt I have.

I'm so happy and grateful for the three high paying clients. I just. Brought in this month, [00:19:00] so happy and grateful for be, and then align your energy with that. Don't be like, I'm tele and great, you know, like, yeah, don't be about it. You, you really gotta sort of be in it like, oh, yay, this is. And it comes back to that belief again, right?

Is like if you're, if you are not believing that it's possible to set these affirmations and these are the things that are gonna transform you or even identifying your patterns and you're just doing it for the sake of it, again, the intellectual, cerebral, I'm just doing it 'cause someone told me to do it and I'm gonna just gonna do it.

You have to believe in what you're, what you're doing for that to transpire. One of the things I want to share, and I think I've shared this on my podcast, my listeners have probably heard this, but you know, I know one of my set points was I grew up in a household where you worked really hard for money.

Mm-hmm. Right? And I grew up in a very masculine household. My mom stayed at home with US kiddos, but I was. With three brothers. I had a dad, very successful dad with his business, successful grandfather. Right? So I was a [00:20:00] lot around, a lot of masculine energy. So it was like work hard for what you earn. Money doesn't grow on trees, basically, right?

And it'll take years to, to earn. The money you need to earn to retire and all of the things. Right. So my whole thing that I blocked myself on my limit was, is that the more I earned, the harder I had to work. Mm. So I naturally just shut myself back because I, or capped myself. 'cause I was like, it's already not sustainable the way that I work, so I can't imagine earning more and then having to sustain that cycle.

Yeah. And the other big one was the sacrificing my creative expression for financial security. Mm. Yeah, that, well, that's cultural. I mean, how many, how many times have we heard about starving artists? If you're an artist, you won't make money, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. Unless you're a Hollywood movie star or something like.

Yeah, totally. Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah, so that's identifying just [00:21:00] where that came from and then the choice to. Do it differently. Yeah. You know, in terms of aligning the energy, uh, I was just gonna say, Dr. Joe Dispenza has spent a lot of time and, and really working with people about aligning your vibrations with what you want, and he's a brilliant, brilliant man.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And choosing what kind of what, what your values are, right? So if we think of abundance and prosperity, abundance and prosperity all around us, but also then identifying what matters to us. 'cause for some people, you know, you might, your set point, let's just say your set point's a hundred thousand dollars, you're earning, but you're working like crazy to earn that money.

Yeah. And all of a sudden you earn that a hundred thousand dollars, but you're working part time, right. Like. Sometimes we don't recognize it. Right? Is that like, well, wait a minute. I'm actually doing the thing that I want. I'm working less, but making more. Yeah. But I haven't even quite realized it, but it's, it's identifying like what [00:22:00] is important, right.

Yes. Yeah. And when somebody's, uh, often, and I know you, you do this too, so what I'm working on something they wanna, I wanna make X amount or I want the house by the lake, or I want this. Like, why, what do you, what's the experience you're looking for? What's the feeling or the energy or the, the, why would that be important to you?

You know, I was working with a client and she's like, well, I want this house by Lake so I can bring my kids and have family gatherings. So really what the value was, connection, family connection. I. Not about the house. And then it's like, well, what are ways you can, you can have family connection even before you have the right house, you know?

Yeah. Or do I want wealth? You know, one definition I heard of prosperity, which I think you're like at one time, was having exactly what you need when you need it. Mm. Having exactly what you need, when you need it, and I thought that was so brilliant. So good. Yeah. 'cause you're right, it's like sometimes, and I, I see a lot of ambitious [00:23:00] high achievers chasing success and how success is culturally based on our society.

Right? The white picket fence, the big house, the boat, the lake house, all of the things it's like, but why do you actually want that? Yeah. And are you actually creating, are you actually. Seeking, chasing whatever building. Mm-hmm. The success set is actually truly in alignment with who you are or you looking outside of yourself, trying to cultivate that based on what you think you should be creating.

Absolutely. Yeah. And I would invite people that are listening or watching to, to just write, what does wealth mean to me? What is wealth to me and why is that important to me? Just give yourself permission to journal, and what you may find is that why it's important is much more about either how you feel.

The connections you have to people in your life, your family, your children, your grandchildren, your future grandchildren, whatever that is, and your [00:24:00] own sense of self in the process. You know, I rarely, rarely find somebody who goes, well, I just wanna be rich and famous. Yeah. Like, I just, I, that's not what people say.

Yeah. Not what they're looking for. If they get honest with themselves. Yeah. And again, I think it's such a beautiful perspective because many of my listeners are heart-centered, right? And that heart-centered Entrepreneur that wants to create meaningful work, wants to be of, you know, do purposeful work.

And it's that relationship with money that is very difficult often 'cause it's like. It's not about the money is what they'll often say, and it's not. It is, it's true. It's not about the money. It's about what the money's going to provide them and allow them to do, but they can't make that connection. Yeah.

Well, I would invite people like that and I, I've heard this quite a bit as well as, first of all, again, culturally we have this sort of. Downloaded energy. Like if you're in service humanity, you shouldn't be making [00:25:00] much money. You know, like a Mother Teresa or a, you know, a teacher living. Look what we pay our teachers, at least in the us it's insane to me.

Yeah, same here. Same to me. And so culturally, and then also do a deep dive in what, what's really going on with my own value and worth. Hmm. So if I provide a extraordinary service, whatever it is, and as a coach or as a, you know, a chiropractor or whatever that is, you know, and I'm, I have. Around asking for money or charging X and not giving away, I, I meet a lot of women who are like, well, I end up giving away my stuff, you know?

Yeah. You know, my services. It's like, what's the value belief you have about you? And who you are in the world. Yeah. Yeah. And I can we dive a little bit more into the worth and the value piece? Because I know as [00:26:00] my high achieving people often don't perceive themselves as not having high self-worth, but.

For me, my experience, it translated into overgiving, overdelivering, like being available 24 7. Yes. Right. Because I was being the martyr, the mother, Theresa, like, I'm, I'm here, I'm available. I'm of service. I can help. Yes. When I did that work, I was like, actually, I just, I don't value my time. Yeah. I don't value my perspective.

I don't value what I'm providing to the world, but I didn't see it like that originally. Mm-hmm. Yeah. So, so if what we're looking for is, um, validation of our value, of our, of our purpose, you know, to be seen, to be valued, to be, you know, uh, acknowledged whatever. Lots of people grow up or find their way of generating value by giving.[00:27:00] 

Becoming a martyr, overgiving, overextending, working themselves to the bone, whatever it is. And so as a substitute for whatever they internally don't feel whole and complete about, they're looking for some form of validation. Now, over givers don't necessarily say to. They're whoever they're taking care of, their elderly parents or their kids or whatever.

Could you validate me? Could you validate me for taking care of you? It's, that's what turns it into a little bit of a martyr energy, you know? Well, I'm giving so much and I'm always giving. That's what I do. It's who I am. And there's this suffering that goes along with that. And that is, uh, and I, I know this is difficult for people to hear, but that's a manipulation.

Yes, clean total manipulation. And so what it is, is I am not feeling [00:28:00] valuable myself, so I'm doing it this way and I want you to fill me up because I'm not full enough in who I am. Yeah. First of all, just for the over givers, and again, this women tend to do this more than men, and, and there are plenty of men that do it too.

First of all, you don't serve anybody by overgiving. You're tired, you're cranky, you're bitchy, you're resentful. You know, you end up, you know, and it's, it's sort of a backhanded way to look for validation and the people around you. You tr we actually train them to need us in that way, and then we resent them when they do.

Yeah. And so it's this weird cycle. So, you know, it's hard, it's a hard habit to break. It's like an addiction. It's literally like the needle is in our, you know, it's, yeah. You know. Well, I don't wanna be terrible. I don't wanna say no, I don't wanna, you know, start with little [00:29:00] things. Start with little things like whether it's you give yourself x amount of time, or you say no once a day or something.

Yeah. It's gonna be super uncomfortable at first and at the same time, and these are the people who undervalue their services and they don't charge, they give it away and somebody says, well, I don't have enough money. Like, okay, I'll coach you for free. You know, like, you know, versus like, okay, well what can you do?

And let me just say, for those people who really wanna be generous Sure. Charge what you charge and then have a certain amount of your services that you do pro bono and be really clear and specific about who you give that to. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, there's a lot of ways for you to be generous without being a doormat.

Yeah. And it's such a, again, like, you know, it is a, it is a hard thing to hear when you are that over giver. 'cause you think you are. Being generous. And then it's like, but then you become resentful [00:30:00] because, and like you said, it's almost, somebody once told me, you know, it's like, you're, you're an overcompensate.

Like that was what I was, I was an overcompensate. So people would see that in me and they're like, I'm just gonna come and get support from Catherine because she's gonna make it happen. But. I didn't value my time at the time or what I was charging in anything. So then, yeah, I'd get into projects and I would be resentful.

But it is, like you said, is they didn't ask for that. It's not like they're sitting there going, I'm gonna purposely latch onto Catherine to get it done. They just saw what I could create, and so they were like, I. Oh, I want that, or I want something similar, whatever. But they didn't think, oh, I'm undervaluing her and I'm taking advantage of her when they, you know, they're not thinking that.

It's never a ne a nefarious, it's, it's more like, oh, you know, again, we train them to be that way. I'm not typically that way and with, I have teenage sons and I can, I can fall into that with them. Ah, yeah. That's what we're doing for them, because I want some [00:31:00] form of validation and then it's about me. And that's what's great about my kids, they tell me I love it.

Oh, you're right. Yikes. Not good. Good. Yeah. So, so couple things. Let me just add a couple things that people can do to open flow, to open the flow of money. One is, do deep dive into whatever the, again, the, the messages you were. You experienced, you saw you, you verbal nonverbal from growing up around money and your own personal experiences with money.

So sometimes people don't have a lot of energy on money, and then something happens like a bankruptcy and then it. Or divorce and then something, something negative gets placed in a belief. So, so uncover that. Also look at where you have patterns for your set points, and then two or three things you can do that just are simple ways to open flow.

One is what I call outflow. It's just the outflowing, [00:32:00] and it's not about overgiving. It's just simply being outflow and generous with your energy, your, your openness, your love. I mean, maybe it's. How it's, maybe it's just being so present when you cook a meal and serve your family. Or maybe it's, you know, picking up medicine for the elderly neighbor.

I mean, it could be a, a, a natural, you know, uh, good, good deed, or it could just be energetically, or you're just joyful when you walk into the coffee shop, you know, outflow of energy. Number two is by appreciating people for who they are, you know, not just what they do. So not just, oh honey, thanks for picking up the cleaning.

It'd be more like, oh honey, I just love and appreciate that you find ways to support me and take care of me. You know, it just, it, it raises our vibrations and it opens up possibility. Gratitude's the same, but you know, we all do the gratitude list. Yeah. It's more than that. It's experiencing gratitude.

Yeah. Yeah. I was actually talking to a [00:33:00] client today and something happened. She's financing something and something fell through and I'm like, well, you know, gratitude's actually being grateful in the moment for what is Yeah. Whether it worked out or not. Yeah. And then affirmations, vision boards, any kind of affirming, because a vision board supports our, uh, the science behind it.

Is it the visualization bypasses our reticular activating system. Yeah. It's that system in our brain that keeps us from jumping off a building.

Maybe see what happens if I jump off, maybe I can fly. You know, our, our reticular says, don't do that. Yeah. Limits are what we see as possible. So vision boards are awesome. Uh, affirmations. And one last thing on affirmations. If people have a sort of, I've had an, I had this myself, but I've had many people say, look.

I think affirmations are great, except every time I say one in the back of my head, there's a little negative voice going. That's not true. That's not true yet [00:34:00] because you have to affirm it as if it is, you know, like it already is. So I was, I don't remember where I saw this. Uh, turn that affirmation into a lofty question.

Oh, so I am so, or I have a hundred thousand dollars in the bank, or I have money flowing every day. Like a, like a fact. Yeah. To a question, why do I have so much money flow flowing into my bank account every day? Or why do I have, uh, you know. Three high playing clients every week reaching out to work with me, because what happens with your brain?

Same thing. Your brain doesn't know what's happened or what hasn't happened. Uh, it'll start to organize our mind and, and everything around us will start to organize to answer the question. I love that. I don't think I've ever heard anyone say it that way because I am the person, again, the intellectual, the cerebral, right?

Yeah. I will challenge the affirmation. I'll be like, this is silly, or [00:35:00] this won't work, or, you know, that's not true or whatever. Yeah. But the question is such a great, because you, like you said, your brain starts to organize. By answering the question exactly how can this happen? What are ways and po we'll start to see possibilities we couldn't see before.

Such a cool thing. I also love the embodiment of gratitude because again, as our, the intellectual, cerebral, logical thinkers, right? That often create the limiting, well do create the limiting beliefs, but the embodiment of gratitude, like looking beyond just being grateful or just saying the things you're grateful for as a like check, check, check.

I did that. I did my gratitude list, but it's actually. Being grateful for the where you're at right then in that moment, whether it's good or quote unquote bad. Not that there is a good or bad, but it's like you're right where you need to be and, and what, what are you grateful for and why? And then how, like what are the [00:36:00] feelings behind that?

That's that embodiment, that experience, which goes beyond just the thinking brain. Yeah, so. So important. So important. So important. Yeah. Good. Good, good, good. Yeah. Well, it's been such a pleasure chatting with you. Um, you too. Do you have anything else that you'd like to share before we wrap up? Well, uh, I wanna share that I really have a deep, heartfelt belief that the universe, God, it is, is an abundant, benevolent energy.

Yeah. And so. Good wants to happen. And one of my favorite questions is to ask myself is, why is this is happening for me? Not why is this happening to me? Why is this happening for me? So, uh, if anything, I would say to your listeners, just, you know, remember that and know that you are the unique manifestation of who you are.

Like, nobody can make the difference. You can make the way you make it. And so trust that and honor that. So that'd [00:37:00] be mine. I love that. I have one final question, and it's around breakthrough. Yeah. Because I know a lot of people come into my world who feel like they're on the cusp of a breakthrough.

Mm-hmm. And they're contemplating, do I stay or do I go, ah, like they've been working really hard to get to where they want to go and, and maybe they haven't realized it yet or manifested it yet. And I know you talk about. You know, the one conversation away from breakthrough? Yes. Yeah. What would you say to that person?

Yeah, and by I, I say you're always one conversation away from breakthrough. I don't necessarily mean a talking conversation, and that could be. A, a interpretation, a way of looking at something so that you can have a breakthrough. So first off, you're right on the cusp and you've been working at this breakthrough.

Like again, do the internal scan, I call it, you know, like a CAT scan internally of like, why am I limiting myself if I achieved this? What am I afraid of? Like get [00:38:00] honest with yourself about that. Yeah. And then secondly, a breakthrough for me. A breakthrough always happens and not only have. I shifted my perception like, you're in the exact same place, but you see everything differently.

Yeah. I'm actually being distinct. I'm, my, my, my energy is different. Mm-hmm. And I can guarantee you it's a, i I have a statement that I talk to people about sometimes, like, imagine you're flying and a plane, it's like 14,000 feet and they open the door and in one hand you have silk and the other you have needle and thread and you jump.

Well, what are you gonna do? You're gonna sew your parachute really fast. Yeah. Breakthrough. You cannot get there from where you are. You have to go for it and generate it as you, you know, soak, thread jump, you know, is what I would say. Yeah. Yeah. I love that it, and really is the perspective is the way we're looking at what we're looking at.

And if we're, and like you said, we won't get to where we need to [00:39:00] go from that same point of view or that same perspective. Yeah. The instructions on how to get out of the box are always on the outside. Love it. Love it. And so with that, would you recommend, like obviously then it's really important to have someone to reflect that back to you.

Yeah. Well I think having a. So first of all, just in terms of setting goals, you probably know this, like if you say something to yourself as a goal, you have like a less than 10% chance of achieving it. When you write it down, it goes up to like 40, and then you speak it out loud. It goes up a little more.

But if you have an accountability partner or accountability buddy goes to like 90%. So having a community around you to reflect back and, I mean, not your, you know, your, your complaining buddies. Yeah. I run BMC bitching, moaning, and complaining. Yeah. Not your complaining buddies, but a but a community of people that [00:40:00] are connected and conscious and.

Love you and want the best for you, and just bounce it off people, you know? I love that. You know, there's, as a coach, I can, you know, as much as I love coaching people one-on-one, and I do that quite a bit, I love a community. I love working with a group because this, the wisdom of the whole comes out. Yeah.

Yeah. And so much insight and perspective comes from just being a witness to other people. Navigating maybe something you're similarly going through, but you can't even put into words and that Yeah. So much. Yeah. Yourself and other people's. Yeah. Yeah. A lot of good. Yeah. Amazing. Well, yes, it's been so lovely having you on.

I know my listeners are gonna, are gonna love this. Um, where can people find you? Yeah, you can find me pretty easily on, on Facebook, LinkedIn, Instagram, Lisa Kelman, just my name. And then, um, I do have, if you can, in the show notes to [00:41:00] put a, a free little gift. It's a quiz, it's a money mindset quiz, and what it gives people is these questions and then you rank 'em and then it'll put you into a category based on your, yeah.

Result of a money attractor, money manager, money scarcity or something, which most people aren't, but it gives you just some, a quick snapshot of where you are. Amazing. We love good quizzes. Yeah. In our world. Yeah. Yeah. So fun. So we'll link all of that up in the show notes for everybody, uh, to be able to easily access that and definitely go take that quiz to see Yeah.

Where, where you're at with your, your money mindset, which is always a beautiful thing to, to be reflected back. So again, it's been a pleasure having you on and I know our listeners are gonna love it. Hey, Catherine, thank you for the work you're doing. I appreciate you. Amazing. Thank you. Thanks for listening.

We'll see you right back here next time. You can also find us on social media at creatively [00:42:00] owned and online@creativelyowned.com. Until next time, keep showing up as your authentic self.