How energy healers can market without losing their soul with Jayne

INTRO: [00:00:00] After generating over a million dollars in sales and selling one of her businesses with a single email, your host Catherine Thompson, takes an unconventional approach to marketing and sales. So if you are ready to tap into a more powerful way to be seen, heard, and a Sought after Entrepreneur in your industry without having to spend endless hours marketing your business and chasing clients, you are in the right place.

Be The Sought After Entrepreneur Podcast is here to help you ditch the cookie cutter one size fits all approach to marketing, and use your unique energy to effortlessly attract the most aligned clients. When you do this, you can spend less time marketing your business and more time doing your soul work and enjoying the richness of your life.

Welcome to Be The Sought After Entrepreneur Podcast, and here's your host, Katherine Thompson. 

Kathryn Thompson: Hey, hey, I am super stoked to have Jane on the show today. I've had the [00:01:00] pleasure of working with her for the last six months, and she is an amazing trailblazer in the area of Reiki, and I just, I can't wait for her to share her story with you, her vision, what she is wanting to create in this world, um, because it is absolutely amazing.

So, without further ado, Jane, um, just take a moment here and introduce yourself to our listeners so they know who you are and what you do. 

Guest: Yeah. So first of all, thanks very much for, uh, inviting me to be here. You know, I really, I, I value you and the work that you bring in the world. So much. So I, I'm really honored just to, to chat to you here today.

So, um, I am a sovereign reiki reclamation mentor and, and spiritual visionary. Now, that's more than, it is more than what I do. It's more than a title. It's, um, it's the core. It's, it's who I am. Um. I don't break mainstream reiki rules [00:02:00] to, um, rebel, I shake up to return to integrity. So in essence, I dismantle what distorts and I restore what is sacred and what is sovereign and what is soul led.

And I've been evolving on this path for about the last decade, entered into the, the spiritual and holistic industry via mainstream reiki and then various, various other, uh, holistic modalities. I tend to voice what others leave unspoken, not with force, but with this deep, real desire to return to personal and, and collective truth.

Yeah, because for me, sameness, it it self-doubt. Isn't it, right? 

Kathryn Thompson: Yeah. 

Guest: We're constantly trying to fit in. We start to question what's [00:03:00] real for us. Yeah. And drifting further from that voice inside the already, it already knows the way. True connection for me isn't found in replication. It's found in reclamation, right?

Yeah. Yeah. Which is actually what led me to you. Amazing. Because I found myself in this place where, you know when most of most people are embodying the theoretical formulas, I am unearthing wisdom to embody and where most people claim to hold the answers or have the how. Yeah. I create the conditions for people to unearth that from themselves.

And where most are, um, providing the bandaids what I'm doing Yeah. Is really cultivating unapologetic empowerment that activates true lasting, uh, [00:04:00] sovereignty. So for me, as an intuitive, I dunno about you, right? Yeah. But for me, as an intuitive, um, I crave depth. Yes. Crave connection. Yeah. Crave freedom, liberation expression.

I do not crave being in a box, being contorted, being inside anything that is cookie cutter. Surface level. Surface level. Yeah. So the, the two for me can't coexist. 

Kathryn Thompson: No. 

Guest: So I found myself in this place of, I. Having a, a business and living a life that was expansive, that's rich, that's textured, that's beautiful.

That's wild. Yeah. And then continually trying to mold myself to fit what seemed to be at that time until of course, I [00:05:00] I found you no other alternative. Yeah. There was no, there was no other alternative than I, I'm gonna use the word mainstream marketing now. When I used to say the words marketing or sales, I would do this.

Oh, well, yeah. Like, it would make make me convulse a little bit. Yeah. 'cause that has been my experience of trying to fit Yeah. Into that mold, you know, where we're not looked at as human beings, but commodities. Yes. Yeah. Yes. Use on a real, or likes on a. I dunno. A piece of content. Yeah. You know, I'm, I'm a human.

People Yeah. Humans. Yeah. So I find myself in this place where I, nothing was, felt, everything felt congruent. It didn't feel congruence. Sorry. I, I, I needed to, [00:06:00] I needed to really find someone who could support me in the way that I supported other people, but in a different, in a different field, obviously.

Yeah. You know, where my, I, my ideas, my expansion could be the things that I, that, the things that I was, the spiritual wisdom that I was channeling. Someone could support me to ground that into reality and actually make it, um, so I could, so I could speak to the people that I needed to speak to so that I could create the impact that inherently I know I sense I'm here to create in the world.

Um, which is where you came in. 

Kathryn Thompson: Yeah. Yeah. And I think, I mean, it's so interesting 'cause I think, obviously I attract a lot of people that are in their industries doing their thing. And like you said, I think you touched on something really, really potent, is that I'm not here to just rebel for the sake of rebelling, you know, like a kid throwing attention.

Mm-hmm. Like, I don't wanna do that. It's like I'm here to really sort of shake up and help people [00:07:00] remember that there is truth that's living within them that's either being diluted, it's being, you know, and not always consciously. Right? It's like, you know, you're, you're intuitive and you're practicing reiki and, and you're in your field and your zone of genius.

And then it's like, but I want to have a business and I wanna offer my services, and now I'm being told I have to market this way, I have to sell this way, and I don't actually fit that. And what's, you know, interesting is, is that as a trained marketer. I came into the online space just drastically feeling that.

I was like, what is going on in this world, like of online coaching and peeling and all this sorts of things. Like what, what is this marketing like? Never in my 15 year career did I have to screenshot money wins to get clients. It was like, it was not even a thing in the offline corporate world or any world that I was in.

And so [00:08:00] when I got in the online world, I was like, all of these tactics that are being utilized, they trigger the the shit outta me. And then I got really curious of why are they triggering me? Well, because it's a, it's indicating what I value and where my integrity lies. And I think the beautiful work that you're doing with your clients and your certification is showing people that they can create.

And work with energy and offer a service and not have to compromise who they are in order to achieve that. And I'm doing something very similar in the marketing world. I'm like, I want you to be able to be in your zone and be in your authenticity and your integrity and be able to make money in your business and not have to sacrifice who you are in order to get there.

Because as an intuitive, we can't do it. Like the pain of trying to go against who we are, those that are very much in integrity and authenticity. It's like if I try to go against that, it's gonna be really painful. And so when you came to me, [00:09:00] what were maybe some of the things you were, you noticed about marketing that didn't jive with you or you noticed about your own field of work that were like so far away from your integrity that you're like, I just can't operate this way?

The information? 

Guest: Yeah, the sheer abundance of information. It's not in, it's not information and advice that I personally crave. More of, right? Yeah. It's, it's the connection. It's, it is depth that I'm craving more of. So this whole three seconds, you've got three seconds to hook someone in scrolling on social media.

And I'm thinking, well, firstly, if I think about myself, I'm not gonna sit here and say I don't scroll on social media. I absolutely do scroll on social media, but I know when I'm doing it, I know when I am con I am conscious in the act of, ugh, I've got five minutes to spare. I'm maybe sitting in the car waiting to pick up the kids out, like gymnastics or whatever.

I'm scrolling right now and I know I'm doing that, you know? Okay. [00:10:00] But however, however that said, I know as an intuitive human that no one is gonna have impact on me. Within three seconds. No hook, no no soundbite, no magic pill, no foot. It, it, it can't work like that for me. Right. And that is mirrored within the work that I do.

I'm forever coming up against things like heal your trauma in a three day course, become an energy worker two days course, and I'm thinking, I get the noise of the external can be loud and the that temporary fix that flashiness that performance over presence. It can be loud. I get it. Yeah. I've took [00:11:00] part in it myself.

However, yeah. From huge amounts, vast amounts of experience. It's not going to give that soul level fulfillment satisfaction. I'm deeply craving, so I have to think then, well, those that I wanna be welcomed, those people that whose world I wanna be welcomed into. Those people who, who I, I wanna welcome them into my world, are sitting out there.

It's very similar to me in that respect. 

Kathryn Thompson: Yeah. 

Guest: So how can I, and integrity with adhering to those values that run through me, through my business. Truth, integrity, respect. How can I show up or try contort myself and this way of showing up where none of it aligns. None, none of that's actually aligning with who I am, what I'm here to do in the world and the [00:12:00] way that I'm living my life.

None it, it just doesn't work. Yeah. So yeah, those are probably the most common. Yeah. Yeah. Sensed coming. You know, when I thought, no, no, there has to be another way. There has to be a better way, a more effective, and just a way that feels in the same way as my work, like I'm coming home. Yeah. Rather than just like another tick sheet of obligations.

Like I, I, you know, I wanna share parts of who I am and, and parts of, of what I do, but I don't wanna do that from a place that feels inauthentic to me or not genuine. Yeah. Because then what's, that's the point. What's the point? That's, yeah. That's the very opposite of who I am and who I'm in my daily life, you know?

So I had to. Really, I was a bit of digging deep, if I'm honest, right in the very beginning to, to, to really say, do you know what, no, I'm gonna dig where I stand [00:13:00] on this. Yeah. I'm gonna watch. I, I had to, I, I shut, I, I stopped following, uh, various accounts online. I came off of various different, uh, people, you know, emailing promises of this, promises of that.

I, I came away from all of it 'cause I thought, no, no, yeah, like all of this noise now. So I must stop. I must come right in, pull right into myself, and really root and right root and ground in my own spiritual authority, which is huge part of I what I do and the way that I serve, um, and support and engaging other people to reclaim theirs.

I must have root and ground and dig right into mine right now. Yeah. Otherwise, I'm gonna start and continue to build a business that just. It's essentially like my nine till five. Right. But with just a bit more flexibility, it's not gonna, it's not gonna feel any different on the inside, you know? Yeah. 

Kathryn Thompson: And that, I mean, that's such a, the beautiful realization and, and, and just something I want people to sort of take [00:14:00] away is like, yes, the other way works.

And yes, you, you likely will create more freedom and maybe more money and all the things, but it's not gonna feel different. And if you're wanting that sustainability and you're wanting that fulfillment, I. Then you, it's gotta feel good. It's gotta, it doesn't matter how much you try to like, try to pretend that it's authentic or we'll just do the thing.

It's, you know, or I'll hire somebody to do it for me. 'cause then, then I'm not having to do it right. That was lots of messaging that I would get from coaches and mentors in my early days. We'll just hire to do it then. You don't have to worry about it. But I'm like, it's still my business and it's not an integrity to who I am.

So just outsourcing that to the people, to somebody else is like, it doesn't, it doesn't make it any better. It's just treating a symptom, right. Rather than getting to the root of what, what is actually here. And I love what you said about impact. I think this [00:15:00] is huge. 'cause I think a lot of people want to create impact.

I would say 99.9% of the people listening to this right now are impact driven people, and they want to create meaningful work and put it out into the world. And what you said about the three seconds, like you're not going to change, like change your life in three seconds. If you could, we'd all be doing it.

There would be zero. You would, there would be no one for you to support because everyone would just be walking around in pure bliss and joy. Mm-hmm. Absolutely. So, so the impact requires depth. It requires getting to the root of things. It requires remembering really who you are to soul level. And that's a process and often a very non-linear process.

It doesn't happen in a, I'm gonna get you from A to B in 2.5 seconds, but also. There's something so beautiful about honoring your practice, about being present, about pausing for a moment, about, [00:16:00] you know, just enjoying the process of it and to have to put some sort of speed on it. To me, again, is just bypassing.

It's like, I don't like being comfortable or discomfort. Like, I don't like the discomfort of this feeling, so I'm going to buy into the message that's telling me I can fix it in three seconds because I just wanna get out of it so quickly and it's only ever just treating the symptom. And so I think that is so huge and it's, and what's interesting is there's parallels, right?

There's parallels in the world you're in. There's parallels in the world I'm in and I can talk to, you know, a real estate agent or I can talk to a doctor or whatever, and there's the fitness industry, like it's just a rampant across the board that mm-hmm. We've lost that sense of just being in the moment and, and try and taking in all of this human experience that isn't always bliss.

And how do we navigate those discomforting feelings, right? We've gotta go deep. [00:17:00] Mm-hmm. 

Guest: And, you know, I'm sure, and I'm, I think I'm actually about to quote you here, but the juices in the journey is something that I'd read at one stage. Yeah. But I'm confident it was you and you know, I, I find that to be really true as someone who's very much an ex-con, control freak, an ex perfectionist.

Um, you know, and actually some respects still very much ha having a stay on top of that and be consciously aware of those aspects and elements of myself. Um, I absolutely understand why we may not like sitting in the discomfort of just not knowing. However, what I found as an intuitive person is. You know, when I, like, as an example, when I reached out to you, I had a feeling Yeah.

If someone asked me to determine or explain the feeling at, at that point in time, I would've said, I'm unable. I'm gonna like, give me, I, it takes, so I go with a feeling and then it'll take me a will to [00:18:00] process and then come back to me and I'll be able to articulate it to you better. Yeah. However, that feeling doesn't ever lie for me.

Yeah. You know, and trust in that. And I think I've actually learned to chase that feeling rather than learning to chase the control or what the external might, you know, deem successful or, um, what I have been like conditioned to feel when it's a yes. You know, oh wait, just now I need to go and, you know, I need to go away and, eh.

Really think about this and, and, you know, how am I gonna do this and where do I wanna get to with this and dah, dah, dah. And before I know it, before I know it, and doing that, I'm already out with, I've already taken myself out with that space of yeah. Listening to myself, trusting myself, understanding that [00:19:00] actually I'm human.

I'm imperfect, I'm messy, but I learn and do it. And that's one of the things that I love about Spellbound and the way that, um, and the way that it is formed very, it's similarly, I can pull a lot of parallels between that and my spirit, tricky pathway. Um, because you know, a bit like you mentioned, they are, I, I, I don't need to be told how, I don't need a blueprint.

I don't need a, I don't need to be shown the way. Yeah. I need to be. Held within who I am, and I want to, to have these skills, I want to be able to ground my own spiritual wisdom in reality. However, I can, that's not my skillset. That that's not what I, that's not what I'm here, that's not what I'm putting this earth to do.[00:20:00] 

Yeah. So having invaluable support around me that can really, that can really nurture and nourish me in the ways that are needed for me to be able to do that. Then it all fits in together. It's like a puzzle. Yeah. Like all the people puzzle coming in. Coming in together for me. Yeah. So coming back to the just and the journey, really, that's the way I like to, that's the way I like to think of that.

I don't like to, you know, I like to work or have a feel. Um, and the majority of those that find their way to me are also really similar in that respect, you know? 

Kathryn Thompson: Yeah. And the whole essence of like, I don't need to be told how. Right. Whereas we look at a lot of traditional coaching, which I can see as ego, right?

Coaches that, or experts that create it based on ego, maybe consciously or unconsciously, depending on who the coach is. But they've created this step, step-by-step formula to to create some form of certainty and some sort of control so that they can say, all my clients got X [00:21:00] results, or blah, blah, blah, whatever, right?

And there's this certainty, and if you don't follow it exactly as I told you, well that's your fault for not getting the results, which is like this whole gross and icky gaslighting sort of environment where it's like it's all your fault. You didn't get the results because you didn't follow my process exactly how I laid it out.

You missed one minute step, and. As you know and anybody listening to this, I mean, there's nothing certain in life and we can't control the outcome. And the minute we surrender to that and go, I'm just gonna follow the feeling, I'm gonna trust my gut and it's gonna lead me to where it needs to go. And when I believe that it's leading me to where it needs where I need to be, and I'm right where I need to be right now in this moment might not be where I want to be, but I'm right where I need to be in order to fulfill the path and journey that I'm here to fulfill so much you, you start to create the conditions for you to develop those skills in quote unquote marketing or business or [00:22:00] whatever that are truly aligned with you.

Because I've been doing this for 25 years and I've worked with hundreds of people at various levels, and I can tell you that the minute someone is uniquely them in what they're doing, I. They create success in ways that are unexplainable. And I saw it in my brick and mortar, right where I operated in that brick and mortar drastically different than I've operated in my online business initially.

And now I've come back to how I was in my brick and mortar, which was just, I mean, I had no, I had no answers to anything. I, I had never made wine before. I had never opened a brick and mortar, but I didn't, I didn't necessarily have mentors around me or I wasn't high, you know, I did have mentors, I had family and friends that had businesses and stuff, and I did do wine training.

So I won't say that I didn't have anything, but I just did. I just operated, I just, every day I'd go to the store and I'd just do what my gut told me to do in that day. Sure, there were [00:23:00] steps I needed to follow to produce the wine, but I never second guess myself. It wasn't until I came online that I really started to second guess myself.

And that's because it was like I walked into that vortex of like, what is going on here? This is so counterintuitive. To how I operate. Connection, depth, authenticity, integrity, not performative. Right? Yeah. Go and, yeah. So it, it's just, it's, it's been a wild journey. And so my question for you is how do you feel like, what do you feel like has changed for you and your being over the last six months?

Hmm. 

Guest: I think the biggest change is a perspective shift. Mm-hmm. Now, for me, success in inverted commas looks very different to what it used to. Okay. And it comes in many ways, in different shapes and different varieties. Right. So where [00:24:00] success to me previously was a quick win, was grounded in a lot of what I would call materialistic stuff.

Yeah. Yeah. Very much. Now is about. Alignment for wanting a better way of putting it, embodying the truth and the essence of who I am. Okay. Yeah. So not only, um, have I, um, developed a process where I can show up and be visible in the way that I need to, like a lighthouse. Right. Yeah. Where I'm not, I'm, I'm being nothing but all authentic, genuine, and absolutely undeniably who I am.

I'm not overstating what I'm here to do in the world, nor am I shying away and understating like who I am and, and, and what I'm do here to do in the world. Yeah. So without, you know, I have a process. I also, one of the big fact, okay, we're going all over the place here, but we're just gonna go with that because there's more than one, right?

[00:25:00] Yeah. Yeah. So when it, social media was always a bit of a, like a, like a, ugh, you know? I never found it an enjoyable, uh, an enjoyable place to be because, yeah, we've spoke about it many times now and in Han today, how loud, how noisy, how information overload that the platforms, platforms were. And I, I found myself anytime I went on there to create.

Being pulled out of that place of, uh, integrity and questioning and doubting. Okay, so now I create everything from a place of a place where it feels just really real, raw, genuine love it, where nothing feels hard, nothing feels forced, everything feels like it is connected. I've completely dropped anything before where it was, you know, views or I mentioned them before, views or likes or whatever.

I'm like, no, [00:26:00] no. When I'm in the integrity, what, like the, the biggest majority of, of, of, um. It's not the biggest majority all of all of the work that I do at, at like a channel. It's it's channel. Yeah. Um, so I know wholeheartedly that when I can remain in that space of embodying, of authenticity, of integrity, I am, um, taken the wisdom that I need to, and I have the skills to actually be able to cultivate that into what I needs to, to be, to be able to put it out in the way that I need to, across wherever I need to do that, you know?

Yeah. And so it feels less like grounding to turn up. Like, who, like who am I? You know, if I wanna show up every single day on social media for six months saying, wonderful, go for it, Jane. But, you know, see, if you don't actually like, like, don't, like what are you doing? Like that pulls you out of your place of integrity?

Like, you know, why are you doing that? So, circling back around to your initial [00:27:00] question. Perspective shift? Yeah. Would be the, the, the overall biggest thing. So out with the actual, you know, the skillset and, um, the, what I have created and what I now have like really, really solid foundations to work on and, and move forward with.

I look at and view sales, marketing, all things associated entirely differently. And for me, that's invaluable. That's price. That's, you can't put a price tag on that because that's not something that's just impacting me in the now. That's not something that's just impacting me for the next six months.

That's lifelong. Yeah. And that is invaluable for me. 

Kathryn Thompson: I love that. I love that. And I wanna talk about what you've created, but first I just want to reiterate to everybody, because I think it's just so important to take away something that you've said that might come across as nuanced for people that may maybe not have picked up on it.

Is, is the like. The whole essence around ROI return on investment, right? [00:28:00] Was it worth my time and money and effort? And I think so much we put it on, you know, was in that program or I was in that experience for four months and maybe I didn't get to my financial success that I, that big financial goal I had or whatever it is, or that big goal that I had set in going in, or maybe things turned out in an unexpected way, which I actually think happens more often than not.

And why it's so powerful of the experience that you're navigating. One is that. Changing your perspective on the way that you look at something is invaluable. And it's lifelong meaning. It's not just about, well, I, I got a return on investment in six months or four months, or three months, which I think a lot of marketing and sales and business, we hang our hat on that, that like, well, what am I gonna get after the four months?

Or what am I gonna get after the two months? And I had a woman just recently ask me that, what's the, what was the return on investment? I shared a story about a client win and she, what was the return [00:29:00] on investment? I said, it's really hard for me to answer that. Yes, financially she made money. However, she now has an asset in her business that's going to produce money for her.

Always. She's got the foundation, she's got an asset that actually is in integrity with who she is, and she feels good about putting this workout into the world. I mean, the ROI is. You know, yes, she made X amount of dollars in the time we worked together, but she's gonna go on and completely fly. And so the ROI, to me, is endless in a lot of ways.

Yeah. And when you change who you are and change the perspective, that is invaluable. Which is why the work that you do and the depth work that many of my clients do, you can put a price tag on it because it's like, well, I changed who I was, changed my absolutely my being, which is the whole message, right, is like, be, do, have, right?

That's the message you'll get what you desire when you start being the person. We just [00:30:00] chase the have. I want to have that thing. I'm not willing necessarily to do the being work, which is the work. Who am I being? Yeah. Mm-hmm. So I wanna talk about what you created. 'cause I think this is, so, like your certification, your process.

I think that's really exciting because of the work that you're doing and, and I want people to, to know about your certification if they're interested in joining or being part of your community. I, I want Yeah, you to be able to share what you, what you created. 

Guest: Yeah. So I support people to reclaim their sovereign energy practice beyond mainstream limitations.

So essentially whether people are qualified at any level, any lineage, or new to the field of energy work. I really call in the people who refuse to dilute their wisdom. And, and here's why. So I'm someone who has spent a. Many years has been a very long [00:31:00] path of searching. Yeah. Hunting down the knowledge, like it sit at the top of the tree, chasing qualifications, certifications, accolades.

I did it for a very long time after entering into the spiritual and holistic sphere. However, I wasn't at school anymore or university anymore. I wasn't a researching moles piece in my corporate career as a journalist. I was seeking soul level transformation. However, that soul level transformation, I think I touched on it earlier on it, you know, it doesn't happen on the mental plane stacking up the textbooks.

It happens when we move beyond the intellect and really. Embody and surrender to intuitive and spiritual wisdom, you know, unearthing and, and, um, the truth of who we are, of what, what lies underneath it. All right, so another really, uh, [00:32:00] clicked for me until I moved past mainstream reiki methods, really using my experience there as a catalyst for my growth and what I went on to kind of be gifted to birth into the world.

And I've lots of li lived experience with it. Um, you know, I've gotten a, an any ability to, to really see to the heart. Something, but very, very clearly, and I, I recognized after having, I was on a, a mainstream reiki master at the time. I, I recognized after years of being there, after building up what the external I would call success in terms of life, in terms of, in terms of financial wealth.

In terms of, of business, we're paying clients that was gonna have to stop practicing. 

Kathryn Thompson: Yeah. '

Guest: cause not an ounce of it was really, I've used the word a lot today, right? Integrity and alignment. None of it, if I'm honest, was an integrity, full integrity, and an alignment with who I really am and the [00:33:00] impact that I knew I was here to create.

And I, I wasn't serving in the way that I wanted to serve, right? So I left behind the title of Reiki master and for about five years, I delved into skill build, skill building, shamanic learning. Um, I, I created. Uh, connections with people and got to understand more about the reiki experiences worldwide. So that's actually then meant I've gone on to, I've got a, uh, an online community.

It's a, no, it's a non-hierarchical community, so there's no all-knowing behavior. No one sits above on top of anywhere else. It's where people's differences are celebrated and welcomed. You're not, you know, silenced because you've got a different way, or a different opinion, or a different way of being or practicing or, or, or whatever.

Um, that has been something that really, really beautiful to come out of that five years of really cultivating those worldwide, uh, relationships with [00:34:00] people. In the end, what I was given wasn't handed down to me. It wasn't a a, a blueprint. It, it was the pathway that I actually had to forge for myself. Yeah.

One, one that was kinda, well, it was forged in the fire to experience, right? Yeah. And intuition and spirit led wisdom. So I created that path for myself, and that's now what I've mentor to other, other people in. And it was really like a homecoming. It was like a, a homecoming to myself or a ton to myself, or a ton of the depth that the, the what had eluded me for so long that I was really, really craving.

Yeah. Um, so the, in, in terms of what that looks like, uh, you know, the, the within itself, I have three key elements that allow someone with other qualified already, or, or new to the, the field of, of energy work to claim their sovereign energy practice. Yeah. And that those three key [00:35:00] elements fit together really snugly, really, really tightly, um, rooted in.

Building and embodying. Okay. The process. And they basically make way for filling in any gaps, any challenges that there can be most often within mainstream Nike are, are filled in with these, uh, with these, uh, three key elements. Um, we might like to think of sovereignty, actually. This is a question I'm asked quite often.

What is, what is sovereignty? G Sovereignty, yeah. You know, sovereignty and, uh, spiritual authority and soul remembering are like a sacred triangle. Yeah. So to connect to our sovereignty, which is what I was really craving for the biggest majority of my time within the, the holistic industry. And initially we've gotta embrace our [00:36:00] inner power.

I. Our unique skills and gifts are innate strength, but we've also gotta remember the soul of who we are. Yeah. So remember, right. That coming home to, to yourself, that depth that is left when all the masks slip away. Spiritual authorities like a culmination. 

Kathryn Thompson: Yeah. 

Guest: Of remembering and sovereignty. It's in our power reclaimed.

And it's the courage to live from that embodied truth. So that one can be a transformational guide for other people. So that's so that one can be a, an authentic leader in their field, not doing it anybody else's way, doing it own way, you know, really grounding that in the, the intuitive insights, the intuition and spiritual wisdom in reality.

Yeah. And allowing all of that to come together and, and pave the way forward because it's, they are that we're rooted in truth. Yeah, they were anchored in authentic personal power. You know, I, I, I, I don't [00:37:00] subscribe to lineages or levels. Um, and I really, uh, it was, it was a decision to, to move away from that, to move away from any structure, any system that did hierarchy, that claimed to know the way, that meant that we were outsourcing, giving power away to anything externally as opposed to owning our own spiritual authority.

Totally. 

Kathryn Thompson: Yeah. Yeah. And I think, you know, it's, it's, um, as you were talking and sharing that is like, again, it's so parallel, right? Is like into all of the different fields as a transformational coach, somebody who's a depth worker, as I call it, somebody who's going deep with people, not surface level practical skill attainment, right?

But like deep work where you're creating the conditions for people, because that's really what you're doing. That's what your process or the, the elements that you have are, are really creating the conditions. They're not a like, follow these three steps or follow this three process. And you'll get to where [00:38:00] like, it's, it's a, you're creating an environment and conditions for people to remember to reclaim, to, to trust, to surrender, to believe in what wisdom's coming through to them.

That might not look like other people. I wanna talk about, you have the pathway as well, which I think is a beautiful experience for people to become certified and, and whatnot. But I wanna key in on the community because we talked a lot about the community and, and you shared with me your, your vision for it and the intention for it.

And I know my role in that because the, when you presented it to me, it is a hundred percent polar opposite to any community that I've seen online. Yeah, yeah. You know, eliminating the hierarchy, allowing diverse communication and conversation, all that. And so we worked back and forth, I know, just on cultivating the energy around that to really make sure that [00:39:00] every part of that community and how it was formed.

Did not have the elements that we often see where it's like you are the leader of this community and that you're building it so then you can sell to them. Of course, you're gonna share your gifts and wisdom, but it's a community of people to come together to, to cultivate and to connect so that they're, that they're truly, you're not selling them on some idea, but you're not also replacing.

One dogma with another. You're not, you're not replacing, well that's wrong, but just follow my steps. And it's right. It's like you're creating these communities for people, whether it be the pathway, whether it be this community that you have online, where people have the safe space to be witnessed and have that, um, the conditions around them.

And so I know we went back and forth a few times 'cause I was, I was really like questioning the intention of every little bit of it so that it did not reflect because it's easy. I think it's [00:40:00] easy and you can say whether or not this is true, but it's easy to, part of the work that I do is unlearning right.

And that perspective shift and unlearning. And so it's like we can be going unconsciously, not knowing because of all the things we've learned. The conditioning that we have. And so it's, it's part of the work that I do is really point out well, you say you want this and you say you want to create this.

My job is to really sort of reflect back and point out where there's incongruencies in, in what you say you want to create and maybe what you're creating. And not in a judgmental way, just in a like reflecting way, Hey, this is how I'm receiving this, or This was what this might look like, or this is how this might be received.

And then really it's up to you and your choice to do what you want with that. But it's just to reflect back to you so that you are fully congruent because again, anybody listening, it's anybody that's really in integrity. This is a hard one that I feel like a lot of guilt and shame can come through when we aren't [00:41:00] operating in integrity and we actually don't know it.

Because of what we've been taught and what we're conditioned to, we can beat ourselves up on the back end of it. And this is not at all what this is. It's, it's just like, I need this in my own mentorship. Everybody needs it. Right? Because we are conditioned culturally, we've got things where, where we live, what we do for a living, whatever it might be, we've been taught things that we think are, might think are right, and we're just doing them unconsciously without us knowing it.

And so, um, I love the intention and what you've created with that community because like I said, it is so different. I have not seen a community online that, that came with that, those intentions. 

Guest: Yeah. Like I had to dismantle everything that I believed about what might work. Yeah. And I've had to, like, I, I've had to go against everything to remain in integrity of what I see happening elsewhere in other holistic [00:42:00] spiritual, reiki based communities to create this, um, which, uh, doesn't always feel comfortable, but it doesn't always feel right.

Yeah, there's a difference, isn't there? Yeah. So my mission is to be part of an integrity rich spiritual industry where, uh, personal, authentic, personal power isn't gate kept or diluted or distorted. Um, but it's liberated and it's embodied and it is honored. Um, and in order for me to do that, I had to really call in the experience of having sat within many of these communities where there's advice.

Presented as fact where there's unsolicited advice where it's save your energy is particularly thick, you know, um, where people, um, would rather focus externally than turn the focus in on themselves internally, where there is a distinct lack of [00:43:00] respect and how we speak to each other, um, and grow together where there is the right way to do things where experience is almost wielded like a weapon.

Yes, I have higher up the chain than you. I have more experience than you. Therefore, what I have the title Masters, like, you know, therefore, I am someone who holds a, a position of power and authority. And let me just tell you, in my experience. The amount of years. That's a bit like saying, you know, your school teacher who is age 90 and still educating primary school kids, um, but was very apathetic and jaded about being there and being in their role is as is better because of their years experience than some new kid on the block that's in their twenties.

That's really fun, engaging. And the, the school kids get [00:44:00] a lot, a lot out of them. Experience does not equal authority, authority, impact, ability, none of it. Um, and it is really, really rife within the, the, the, uh, reiki world in particular. So what I really wanted to do within the community was bring energy workers or those interested in energy work together where they, well, they can mix within the monthly reiki, uh, within the monthly, monthly reiki mixers where they can connect on a professional level.

Um, and. Not collect contacts and cost, but actually develop mutually beneficial relationships on a professional and a personal level for themselves, for their bank balance, in a way that's aligned, in a way that actually cultivates the connection and the depth that we've constantly spoken about here today.

You can be inside the peer tent, not a passive space, not a space [00:45:00] where we're gonna, you know, we're gonna zap the energy and take everything from the space, but like this genuine space of, of kinship where there is support there where no one's wrong, where no one's opinions and views are held above or, or, or, or above anybody else's.

And then if people feel called to, they can dive into embodied echoes after the pod. So my podcast really redefined as. I wanted to create something, workshops, activities, things that people could really dip into and dive into to if they felt, if they, you know, unearth the truth for themselves in my podcast and, and thought to themselves, well actually I want to integrate that and I wanna apply that in my life.

How am I gonna do that? We have a workshop to follow that up, or, you know, and embodied activity to, to be able to do that for yourself. Yeah. None of this has given the power away. It's all about reclaiming it and bringing it back in. 'cause that's what sovereign energy practice is. That's, 

Kathryn Thompson: yeah. It's like a rejuvenation, right?

When [00:46:00] you actually like, and we, and we talked about that 'cause we talked about like the awkward networking, right? Or like, you, you go to these events and they're not fruitful because they're not genuine. You're like, they're, we're not developing genuine connections when you go to like these, this is just my experience with networking, but I'm, I'm not a, I'm not a networker.

I rebel networking because it's, it's, to me, it's awkward because I crave genuine connection. And so anytime I've been in those experiences, it's like, what am I getting from you? What value are you gonna give me? Or what value can I sell you on? And it just doesn't feel, just, it feels awkward. And so I know that the, the intention of that, of the group, particularly the mixing mixer, uh, sessions and, and whatnot, was like, this isn't about like collecting cards and then who can I hit up later for?

It's, it's quite literally. Forming genuine connections that can. [00:47:00] Create value in your life and in your practice that might not necessarily be monetary. I think this is another key thing is that oftentimes we go into these business settings, it's like, well what, what, how, how much more money will this make me?

Or if I meet with this person, will I get X clients or will they refer clients to me? But like you said, perspective shifts are huge, are invaluable. Can you imagine being in a group of people and going to a mixer and being like, I have no expectation of what I'm gonna get out of it. And you all of a sudden have these like wild perspective shifts.

I mean, that's worth weight in gold. And we, and that's what I love about the way that you're approaching this, is like value comes in all forms and Sure, yes, in your bank balance would be great, but it comes in all forms. And if you plug into this environment, it's not gonna be about extracting, it's about rejuvenating.

It's gonna be fruitful, it's gonna be life giving in a lot of ways. Yeah. It feels alive, like there's a liveness to it rather than this like, [00:48:00] extraction model that we live in, in society. Right. Just how much can we take? 

Guest: I feel that's really important as well within like, uh, the, you know, I'm, I'm starting to actually move away from using the word healing as much because I feel that particularly I've seen a shift in the past six to nine months where healing has become a sort of, um, it feels low when people speak to me about it.

It actually feels like it's pulling me into a lower vibration. Yeah. But it's, that's not what's meant to happen with this, you know, but, but you know, it's about letting go. It's about shedding the old, and I'm like, whoa. No, no, no, no. It's about welcoming in it's about Yeah. You know, expansion. Yeah. This isn't this, this, I, I, when we talk about healing, I wanna feel excited.

I wanna feel excited about the opportunities. I wanna feel excited about the version of myself that I've yet to, to me, yeah. I wanna feel. Um, the experiences and the people and, uh, you [00:49:00] know, that, that I've yet to come into contact with. So that's the energy that I bring and I aim to cultivate, um, and meet within, within the, uh, within the online community because yeah, it just feels very different to species and places that I've sat in before for sure.

Kathryn Thompson: Yeah. Yeah. So what are you excited about going forward in life, generally? In life, in business, and in all of it? Yeah. 

Guest: What makes me excited? Yeah. In Eunice when I don't know something. Yeah. So conversations that stimulate me on many levels. So, um, the. I crave, I know you'll start talking human design here, right?

Yeah. But I crave an intellectual conversation. Yeah. So not necessarily like book learn theory, intellectual conversation, like something that sparks something in me. I [00:50:00] am grateful enough now to be surrounded in my life with, um, many versions of what I would call creative people. You know, artists, authors, um, in many, in many varieties.

Not just their title, but you know, in the same way that I do embo people who embody the truth of who they actually are within the work that they do in the world. Right? That's what I'm trying to say. And surrounding myself with people like that. That's what makes me excited. Love it because I leave these conversations, spaces, places, meetings, um, simple daily interactions with something.

Kathryn Thompson: Yeah. And 

Guest: I leave with, uh, something to think about or. I'm challenged. I enjoy being challenged. Um, I, I don't particularly enjoy when, um, and this is again, one of the reasons that I move away from a hierarchical approach to anything. I don't want to be revered for a skillset. Uh, you don't want to, um, be placed above, uh, [00:51:00] anybody else in a peg in order, because everybody ha is unique and everybody has their own unique gifts to, to, to bring to the world, right?

And I want to be able to learn from other people. I learn every day the moment that I move from becoming a student, from learning from, you know, I speak often about the, the conversations that I have down in my local shop, the people that serve me bread and milk on a daily or bi daily basis, conversations that I have with, with those people.

Brilliant. Golden, absolutely golden. I leave the majority of those small, small daily interactions with.

Something fresh. Yeah, something new, you know? Yeah. The moment that, that I become complacent in thinking that I can't learn or can't, um, you know, just find something interesting within those that [00:52:00] surround me on a daily basis, is the moment that I would need to question what you're doing, Jane. Yeah. What are, what you doing?

So, what makes me excited is something new, something fresh, something unique, something with, yeah. With depth. Anything that's below surface level. You know, I don't have a particular say to me, what's your passion? Uh, you know, I can tell you the things I do like swim outside in the sea, et cetera, et cetera.

But what I'm passionate about is that type of energy, and that energy comes in all different shapes and forms of my life. I. 

Kathryn Thompson: Yeah. Yeah. I love it. It's like, it's like experiencing life. It's, it's, it's soaking up all of life has to offer in the, in the moments of your daily world and, uh, the variety of that, but the newness of that, the freshness of that, which is such a beautiful way to sort of operate, I think, in the world or be in the world because, like you said, I can go down to [00:53:00] get my milk or whatever and have a conversation with somebody.

It might be the same person, but it's just a different conversation. It's a different day. But also, like you said, the, the non-hierarchical thing, right? That. It doesn't matter what you do for a living, it doesn't matter. It's like, who, who are you tell? And I always say that, right? Like, I don't care how much money you make, I don't care how big of a house you live in.

Like, tell me something real, tell me something interesting. Tell me something about your life so that I can understand you better, right? If, if, if it's just the surface level of like the status and the dah dah, dah, like, which is why I find networking awkward. 'cause I feel like it's all this small talk of like, this is what I do and this is how much money I'm making.

And I'm just like, tell me something real, like, what makes you excited? Tell me what makes you excited. Tell me what your passions are. Like I want to know that stuff. I don't, I don't care about, um, yeah. The surface surface stuff. So I love that. 

Guest: Yeah. Like I spent so long as well trying to hide that, [00:54:00] the sensitivity and the depth that I had.

Yeah. Because it, um, almost seemed like a. A bit of a blight, you know? Yeah. Like, like craving that deeper, uh, conversation when actually, when I unearth my unique gifts and skills here in the world as somebody who's deeply, intuitively empathic, um, I realized that, and, and, and I managed to work with that unique gift from a place of empowerment as opposed to being tracked within that gift.

Um, I really at that point started to learn, wait, actually the gold lies in here for me. This is the gift. This is not the burden. You know, things that I'd previously seen as a burden that came along with being that intuitive empath. Actually, once I, I learned how to work with that as opposed to perhaps I had been grown up to, you know, to view that and to experience that.

I was like, oh, wow. Oh wow. Actually, this is my gift. 

Kathryn Thompson: Yeah. 

Guest: Hold the gem. It, it [00:55:00] lies inside here in the depth, in the sensitivity in. Empathy and the e tiveness in all of it. Like, that's who I am and no longer can I shield myself in the world from this because actually it's cutting me off from the connect in connection.

It's cutting me off from not only knowing myself, but from in experiencing that level of excitement, being able to connect with those people in, in small moments of my day and, and being present in those ways. Um, so yeah. 

Kathryn Thompson: Yeah. Yeah. Such a gift, right? I think there was a moment where I had said to somebody, can you just help me?

Help me not to feel like just, is there like a dial I can just turn off in my body so that I don't actually feel anything I want, I don't want any emotions. And of course, my beautiful mentor was like, yeah, sure. Helped me realize obviously that it is a gift, but there is energetic boundaries and whatnot that I need to cultivate [00:56:00] for sure.

But it's like my gift is, I am very instinctual, very intuitive. I can sense things, I can predict things, right? Not from like a crystal ball perspective, but I just get this sense or knowing of where we're going. Um, yeah. So it, it is, it is our gifts, you know? But again, in this world that. Doesn't necessarily or hasn't recognized that we're, obviously things have massively shifted, but like growing up I think that was like, what is that?

You know, um, that instinct or that intuition is like not practical or you can't, it's not tangible. It's hard to make sense of 

Guest: things. Yeah. It's uh, you know, even thing, think about things that, think about things that we're told. You know, a common one for me would be Jane, she would give you the shirt off her back.

Like, it's a good thing. Yeah. Like having the, the, the ability to say, like having the ability to [00:57:00] say yes all the time and never be able to say no. Yeah. It's a good thing. Or people would say to me a lot. You always just know how I feel and I think Yeah. 'cause I feel it too. Yeah. I have, I, I have no energetic boundaries.

Yeah. Like all humans. Yeah. Have the ability to pick up scientifically and take on emotional and, and other people's emotions and, you know, energetic stuff, however, is an intuitive empath that was like. That was who I was. Yeah. You know, all, all of my emotional, energetic stuff was intertwined with everyone else's on an energetic level and then on a physical level, you know, I didn't grow up in a, in a, in a, in a society and a culture and a household where, um, I had, I had the physical skills to be able to.

Yeah. In state boundaries, not take on the mood of the person in, in, in the room. Yeah. And let that define me. Um, to [00:58:00] just be able to move about the world where, um, I wasn't constantly open and feeling and either giving away my energy to someone else or picking up and taking on their energy, which when I ended up going, you know, um, going down the, the, the, the, the route of reiki being pulled down that route, I didn't understand the significance impact this would then have in my practice of entering into that experience as trapped within those gifts rather than, than empowered within those gifts.

And so a whole onslaught of, uh, various different experiences and should, um, but that one's, that, that's probably been, uh, a huge learning for me. Certainly it was over the first kinda. Three and four years of being into the, doing what I'm doing. 

Kathryn Thompson: Yeah. And 

Guest: on earthing, um, the, the gems that, that, that, that, uh, lay inside that gift rather than the everyth [00:59:00] than just being kinda like, like stuck inside there.

You know, like trapped like a burden. 

Kathryn Thompson: Yeah. Which is probably for many energy workers is probably one of the biggest things that we navigate. I mean, I'm in marketing, but I, I'm very much an energetic being like I amplify within my own system. I can amplify everybody else's emotions and all. It's all of a sudden it's like, why am I, like, I walk into a room and if I'm not grounded, I am like, vibrating off the walls.

Right. It's just like, I just go hide in the bathroom for a moment and just like, yeah. As wild. But it, but I, you know, so as, as a, an energy works, somebody who does this in their practice, it's like. How to, how to not take on all of that emotion. Yeah. 

Guest: I think that, I think what a lot many people don't realize is that a mainstream reiki attunement, [01:00:00] um, actually highlights and heightens and amplifies your natural, intuitive, empathic qualities.

Okay. But if you go into that attunement experience, I, I, it's attunements aren't something that I subscribe to. However, if you go into that attunement process, like trapped within those gifts, that the way that I, I refer to that, um, you're certainly not gonna come out the other side of it being empowered within them.

You're just heightened, intensifying those qualities without being able to, um. Separate your energy from other people's energy in daily life without having the physical skills to actually maintain, not to sustain your own personal energy. Then you go into a session with a client, right? Yeah. Where everything is heightened and what happens it's is energetic bleed, essentially.

So what happens there is you're giving away your energy to the client or taking on the client's energy on as your own. So you're feeling [01:01:00] anything from hot, sick, drained, tired, depleted, however your client might be feeling. 

Kathryn Thompson: Yeah, 

Guest: yeah. And then what? What we're told is ground more just ground more. 

Kathryn Thompson: Ah. Just 

Guest: like grounding makes up for a lack of energetic protection.

Yeah. Because the can be similarities there between and the feeling chaotic and flighty and all that sort of stuff. Yeah. The, on the main, the, the unseen, the, the mechanics of unseen energy. There's no kinda foundational in, in mainstream energy training. There's no kinda found what I call basic foundational understanding of how unseen energy works on that emotional level and on that spiritual level.

It's why people come to me saying, I keep getting a flash of something out the side of my eye, Jane. Or I might be meditating and I see or hear or saying something or like, what does that mean? All of it has meaning. All of it has meaning that being grounded into daily reality is very unique to you and your one of a kind way.

Um, [01:02:00] but that, that kinda, yeah. The, the, the basic knowledge of the mechanics at unseen energy is very much isn't there? So you kinda head off and out into the. The, the down the path of reiki, hoping to seek this sole level transformation for ourselves and, you know, support other people in some kinda way in a similar fashion.

However, all the, we're just stacking up, we're just stacking up the gaps over, over this end. Um, especially when it comes to that, that what tends to be a key and main gift of, of, um, that intuitive, empathic gift, you know? So. Yeah. 

Kathryn Thompson: Yeah. And then just like you said, you become trapped in it and bogged down with it, right.

It becomes this like weighted weighted thing. Well, it's been, yeah, such a beautiful conversation here today. Is there any final thoughts that you would love to add before we wrap up? 

Guest: Perhaps, um, perhaps this, I can hear the word human, so perhaps [01:03:00] this, I feel that it's, you know, now more than ever for me anyway.

Really. Really important, really vital to remember to be human. Yeah. That I am human. That we are human and perfect, messy, beautiful, multidimensional, complex humans. Yeah. And with a rise in what I see recently, you know, I, I, I heard you just, just recently talking about AI as an example. Um, and I've spoke today, my experience of, you know, on social media, et cetera, et cetera.

I think now more than ever, there is a, a deep, I feel like, like a deep vibrate, like it pulses like a deep calling. 

Kathryn Thompson: Mm-hmm. To remember 

Guest: the, the humanness, the interconnectedness, the sacredness that there actually is just in being human. Yeah. Just in being human and connecting on that, [01:04:00] that human level when actually I.

From, from my perspective and what, from what I see to be true, there's a, a bigger and bigger shift away towards a world that doesn't value what I do. Uniqueness. Yeah. Authenticity. Yeah. Connectedness, sovereignty, sacredness, you know, so for me, yeah, there's a, like, there's a bigger, uh, pull for me now more than ever to really, as I said before, dig where I stand to be true who I am.

Um, even if that stages does feel, uh, uncomfortable, and to seek out the type of people around me and to support me in my life, particularly when it comes to my business. Um, because that is who I am and what I'm here to do in the world. That really feels genuine and right for me. 

Kathryn Thompson: Yeah, I love that because like anything, you know, when the internet came online or when Instagram became a thing, or TikTok or [01:05:00] AI or all the things, they're just tools.

Just technology tools. And I always say there, there is pros and cons always to, to new inter new introductions. But it's who are you being behind the tools? Who are you being when you're using the tools? Because if you're not in integrity and you're not operating in that integral way, that's where things get very blurry in an online world, specifically now with AI, where images can be created instantly, right?

Like what's real, what's not real? And that's where that truth, which is one of the highest vibrations, it can't be faked and people will feel it. They will feel it, that truth, that authenticity, that integrity, they're going to feel it. And I always say words have vibration. So if you're literally just saying to an AI machine going, write me emails to my clients saying, you know, selling them on X, Y, and Z, and it just spits [01:06:00] it out without you coming with your own channel input.

Insight, right? That like you're not, you have to be the human behind the tool, right? You have to be the human behind Instagram. You have to be the human behind TikTok. You have to be the human behind ai. I'm not saying not to use those things. Obviously they're great tools to help in business, but it's like you still have to be the human behind it, and you've gotta be authentic and integral in what it is and how you're using it.

Yeah, absolutely. 

Guest: Absolutely. 

Kathryn Thompson: Yeah. Amazing. Well, it's been, yeah, so lovely chatting with you. I know our listeners are gonna love this. Where can they find you? If they want to reach out to you? You can find 

Guest: me at. Reiki redefined.com. You can find me at reiki redefined on the majority of 

Kathryn Thompson: social media platforms.

Awesome, awesome. And we'll link all of those up in the show notes so that you guys can easily access them. But definitely go reach out [01:07:00] to Jane if you are. If you have an energy practice and maybe you're feeling disconnected from it, maybe not aligned with it, or you're just seeking community, a really beautiful community that allows you to really show up is, is who you are.

Definitely reach out to Jane. She's absolutely amazing. I love what she's doing. Um, and I love the mission that she's on. So, um, thank you for being on the show and sharing your amazing wisdom and gifts with my community. Thanks so much for having me a, 

Guest: a real pleasure, a real pleasure. Really enjoyed chatting to you.

Awesome. 

INTRO: Thanks for listening. We'll see you right back here next time. You can also find us on social media at creatively owned and online@creativelyowned.com. Until next time, keep showing up as your authentic self.